Where shall development take us?

[carbz]

hmmmm. I played at promisance sites that had all sorts of add ons like you describe bjorn. Empires of power had armour and all that jazz, and you could train your troops and incerase skill levels. It then just became a race to research stuff, and the fighting and diplomacy took a back seat. Admittedly though, that prom was based on the qmt code.

For me the game must remain so that no installation is necessary, the fact the game is accessible anywhere and at anytime is what makesd games of this type fun.

[Freenhult]

I dont' mind that to an extent Bjorn, no one does. But when its getting super complicated and time consuming its just not fun.

IF there was a way to make it less complicated, while still adding it in, thats fine. Theres varying levels of complicated that are good. I wouldn't care if we had a game where it was like we have now, and one that required alot of micromanaging and such. It just adds diversity to our selection.

[Shadow I]

You should be able to play at as complex and micromanaged a level as you want while still being competitive at almost any level. Very difficult to do, but it definitely keeps the new players.

[Ruddertail]

Shadow - doesn't that make the extra, complex levels irrelevant? Or would they give some advantages, so you could do well without them, but would still lose out to those who use them?

[Shadow I]

I'll use your cashing strat as an example. You said it is the most complex strat to run because of tax rate. I say I can still do reasonably well without ever touching my tax rate. I won't be able to produce as much as you, but it is still viable. The deeper you go, the more reward you get, but you don't have to go deep to have fun.

basically your second point

My argument for an ideal game would be that all strats should be like this. Impossible I know, but somethig to work for.

[Ruddertail]

Something like that would be good, yeah. But let's try to stay away from stuff that takes too much time. I should be able to get to the top without spending hours a day just fiddling with things on the game itself.

[Shadow I]

Agree 100%. I don't like the micromanagement idea. I have seen several games (some promis) that run with the same kind of idea, and I rarely stay long enough to use a turn.

[Freenhult]

I think we need complex strats. Whats the challenge if we can't mess up and all. Easy ones mixed with harder ones please.

[Ruddertail]

Freen - I agree that sounds good. I see two difficulties.

1: To really create more strats, more complicated strats, what you're really looking at is a total redesign of the game. Working with whole new mechanics and stuff. I suppose you might get buy with a ton of features, and stuff... that might create new strats. But, again, there should be some incentive to run the new strats, they should suit different play styles, or provide some advantage over the less complicated strats. Otherwise, why should I run something more complex when I can do as well with my same old basic indy?

2: No matter how complicated you make stuff, it will never stay that way. As people get used to them, they start finding out all ins and outs, and pretty soon, a complex strat is as simple as indy. It's like learning something in school. You used to think addition was pretty hard. Then that became easy. Multiplication and division were hard for a while. Then those got simple, too. Now, you're probably on to calculus. If you keep on with math, soon basic calc will become simple, or at least manageable.

Procedural complexity might remain, but procedural complexity is just a hassle. Like a casher strat. That's not the kind of complexity I really want - more time running, more chances to screw up, not out of lack of knowledge, but out of trying to hurry through the thing that's taking 30 minutes of time I'd sooner be spending planning a take down on an emp.

[Freenhult]

Then rework stuff. Thats the main idea. Alot of the strats will change once market storing and the economic package gets going. Lets face it, we WANT the Public Market to get used. Thats going to encourage alot of stuff.

And Yes. It does get simple in the end, but thats fine. Thats the point where you're a pro and you can do magic with that strat. Kinda like me and Agra Indy. It fine! It doesn't feel boring at all, but maybe thats just me.

The reason you should try something more complex is because its harder to get screwed over in the long run. Its much more easier to recover with Agra Indy compared to just a plain Indy or just farmer. Thats the perk. Hawking is slightly complex with the ratio. How do you epically destroy a hawker? It takes alot of work to do that.

That in itself is what MAKES the game fun. The war, the thinking, the peace and such. Its nice to want to play with people, but I won't stick around if we just want dumb people who are interested in large numbers. Thinking and at least intelligence should remain. Otherwise, whats left?