Clan Treasury: slight modifications

[Death]

People are trying to make it more balanced. I know people just hate losing their cheap tricks, but it happens. Well, maybe not here, but in most cases it does.

[maddog]

So using the clan market as it should be used to aid and benefit ur clan is a cheap trick so be it. In my opinion the only cheap tricks there is in this game is people dropping loads of land and people joining clans emptying the clans treasury and then leaving the clan, thats cheap tricks

[Death]

Oh no, I like the idea of a CM. But using the CT to put one person in 1st is pretty lame imo, I kinda see why FaF is so small now. lol

I mean the person does not deserve the spot, other people can do better and still get beaten by them, it's pathetic.

[maddog]

i know for a fact that the last set and this set the top watchtower clan member has been there or there abouts all set with out getting aidied and now towards the end of the set hes getting aidied a little bit to benefit the clan for a clan win isnt a cheap trick its a clan strat to achieve being the best clan some times it works sometimes it dont .

But i would agree with u if the person was getting aided all set without running a single turn from when they left protection then yes it would be a cheap trick as that person has done nothing to warrant being there but i havent seen any evidence of that happening in the last set or this set

[Death]

The point is, people win at FaF when they don't deserve to. You can win best average clan net and best overall clan net without doing that.

But it's not like it will change anyways, hahah. FaF needs something to draw people in, and if it isn't balance I don't know what it will be, but I'm just going to play another game I'm on the Dev team on next set, cause I like balanced games.

[maddog]

Truth of the matter is whatever changes if any are made someone will always be unhappy with what happens

everyone was unhappy in the past when farming was strong and there was market storing and someone like arty who was a master at using the farming strat was always winning that got nerfed to try and even things out then mages became the strongest and over the last few sets a mager has won people now want magers nerfed a bit fair enough now in last set and possible this set a clan member is going to win people now want changes made to the CT.

The only way to make this game balanced is to make all the races the same strengths and weakness and do away with things like the CT altogether which at the end of the day is totally unrealistic as there is no tribes which have the same strengths or weakness

[maddog]

ps as for my win last set i can honestly say it was because i did put 90% of the work into it and i was only the last day of the set that i didnt run and was aided the exact same this set with dither he is there on merit and not because hes been aidied there

[Freenhult]

The point is Death, this isn't a balance. This is a tipping mechanism. You hit the cT and you make clans less attractive. Only reason people clan is for the cT and cM.

And this isn't the reason our player base is so small. I don't give two craps about your opinion since your ego is just spilling out now. Death, the great developer who can see all the solutions to all our problems. Yes, my god, no wonder you get into trouble everywhere you go.

Its pretty well decided that we don't want this changed. So why is there even a debate going on?

And yes Shadow, I'm not ignoring you. We need something like what Volk suggested. I'm completely for that. Lets limit emps and that should be enough to weaken stuff in BFR.

[Death]

*rolls eyes*

"Wha no you're wrong, I'm right, you're stupid, you have a big ego, you get in TWOUBLE on other sites"

Grow up. And according to the poll, quite a few people have an interest in something being changed.

Edit,

And yes, it would make clans less attractive, because it would make them less overpowered. Other games do fine with several clans without even having a CT or CM.

[Freenhult]

How many of those votes were your friends? You said you had people look at that. And there are more votes than people that have even posted/active on our game. So I'm willing to bet thats inaccurate.

How many times have I said we don't want to BE like other games. Since when is the same boring hamburger attractive?

And I am quite grown up. I'm not the one who's further dumping whines all over the place. Except in response to yours. Give it up. Its over. The people who play >>>> than random people for opinions.

[Death]

I asked one person who is currently playing BFR to look at it. He had no forum account, and he made one to vote.

And again, you would not be like other games, you have the same exact CT that EVERYONE has.

But yes, I'm just whining everywhere, not trying to debate a point.

You win though, I don;t have the interest to deal with people like you online, so go ahead and get the last word if you have to.

[Freenhult]

This isn't about you or me winning. Its about what the game wants. And it looks like the game wants to keep our thing. And we don't have the same cT that everyone has. There are plenty of games that don't have them. We already said we're going to poke it some and what seems to be getting agreed upon is what we're going to institute.

[Shadow I]

And yes Shadow, I'm not ignoring you. We need something like what Volk suggested. I'm completely for that. Lets limit emps and that should be enough to weaken stuff in BFR.

Relax, I never accused you of anything like that. Our playing styles and personalities clash a bit, but that doesn't mean we can't have a civil argument. Sometimes

Volkov's suggestion is a good start, but limiting it to even one withdrawal per day won't stop a clan that runs together. Everyone fills the CT, then one person withdraws. There is also the CM that can be used to transfer troops at almost no cost, albeit with a 6 hour delay that really won't get in the way of anything if the clan times their run right. He's on the right track, but I can still think of ways to abuse his system fairly easily.

The point is, people win at FaF when they don't deserve to. You can win best average clan net and best overall clan net without doing that.

Wrong. Ditherer has been sitting in the top 4 all set, and has held top for a fair amount of the round. Aiding him up is just a way of rewarding the most hard working of our clan members this round. I suspect that KOH will take it through the same methods, and that's fine, because they have worked for it and someone deserving of the position will get top. (Low net doesn't mean a bad player:storing is still an issue here, market or no. Right now it is possible to hide about 60% of your net - 25% in each of the reserve and CM, and another 10% (depending on your strat) in the CT). If they aided you up to the top at the end I would say that it was an indeserved win, since you have done nothing but sit on vacation and complain all set about people being lame. Almost ironic.

The CT and CM are not necessary for clans. There is still attraction, especially for new players who like to be involved with something other than playing alone and learning little. For older players, clans are a way to dominate and work as a team toward a common goal. To be honest, I don't like the CM or the CT at all, but I can't see them being removed any time soon.

[Gen. Volkov]

Oh no, I like the idea of a CM. But using the CT to put one person in 1st is pretty lame imo, I kinda see why FaF is so small now.

Why would my proposed fix not affect both types of abuse? The same methods used to make an emp would have to be employed to put somebody in first, wouldn't they? I agree with you as far as that goes, the CT should not be abusable to the point that you can put somebody in first or as emp without them having to do anything.

And yes, it would make clans less attractive, because it would make them less overpowered. Other games do fine with several clans without even having a CT or CM.

Clans are not overpowered, if they were, clanned empires should win every BFR set. Instead, unclanned ones do, I think you are looking at the advantages of a clan without looking at the biggest single disadvantage of a clan, the unlimited attacks. Unlimited attacks mean absolutely anyone, no matter how strong, can be brought down.

Volkov's suggestion is a good start, but limiting it to even one withdrawal per day won't stop a clan that runs together. Everyone fills the CT, then one person withdraws. There is also the CM that can be used to transfer troops at almost no cost, albeit with a 6 hour delay that really won't get in the way of anything if the clan times their run right. He's on the right track, but I can still think of ways to abuse his system fairly easily. 

Shadow, how many clans have you been in that run together as a group? I've only been in a few that do. If they are that organized, I highly doubt a little thing like limiting the CT is going to slow them down that much. Besides, as I already said, the amount in the CT, even in a large powerful clan, simply isn't enough to make an emp with one withdrawal. It can help, but that's all it can do. The rest will have to be sent through aids or produced by the potential emp. The CM is more abuseable, but it's much slower than an aid, and the coordination required is once again great enough that the clan is probably going to dominate anyway. Still, I would be in favor of CM modifications that make it harder to abuse.

The CT and CM are not necessary for clans.

Correct, but that doesn't mean they can't make clans more attractive.

[Freenhult]

I wasnt' going after you Shadow, I was just poking a few points you made. No worries.

And yeah. You should see the KoH treasury working. Theres always funds in there, always food, and runes. I get on at least once a run, sometimes an extra time or Linux, and take the extra cash from the hawkers and buy more of the BM and cM as much as I can. Then FA a bit around if I can.

Either way, it doesn't matter if the restriction is lost. Outside communication is just as key as ingame. All I need is an IM saying FA'd you cash, buy up. Doesn't matter if I just yoink it from the cT or not. I still got a large chunk of it.